objectification, humiliation, or something else?

[andy wood]

Everyone,

I am a switch. I tend to like doing the same things to a female sub that I enjoy being done to me by a domme.

I want to find the right label to describe my type of play. I think that "humiliation" is in the right ballpark, but may not be quite right. Maybe the best term is "objectification". Here are a couple of examples of that being done to male subs, from Queen Lucia's tumblr:

http://queen-lucia.tumblr.com/post/6140 ... t-right-my

http://queen-lucia.tumblr.com/post/1068 ... p-me-yes-i

Here are some examples of female subs being treated that way, from the tumblr of a subfem named Little Lisa Ten:

http://littlelisaten.tumblr.com/post/11 ... -to-remind

http://littlelisaten.tumblr.com/post/98 ... gh-too-too

http://littlelisaten.tumblr.com/post/76 ... -it-either

What these images have in common, IMHO, is that the submissive is a sex toy for the dom/me. Some types of humiliation are insulting, and express emotional sadomasochism. (Ex. - "You are stupid, weak, immature, and pathetic.") In contrast, with objectification, the submissive is not necessarily viewed as stupid or weak... those traits are just irrelevant. The purpose of the submissive being in the presence of the dom/me, is for the submissive to be undressed and used as a sex toy. The mind of the sub in this case is not viewed as being inferior or defective... just irrelevant.

So, what should I call this? I think that the best label is "objectification", and that it is a subtype of humiliation play. But if there is a better way of describing it, I would like to know it.

A second question that occurs to me is this: Does a switch typically like to receive the same type of play when submitting, that he or she likes to give as a dom/me? Or is that just me?

Regards,

Andy

[Noah]

I would not necessarily call that objectification (unless the dom/me really does not care about her/his sub). In a dom/me-sub relationship you acknowledge the submissive trait of someone by dominating him/her. A good dom/me will use the mind against the sub, therewith acknowledging his/her mind (just like the helpless arousal in the first image). I'd just call this pleasure hierarchy or selfless submission? haha.

I do think that I have the same 'switch dynamics' in general, but it highly depends on the preferences of the girl I am with.

[sissy jasmine]

For your second question I certainly use the same ideas and techniques when I Domme that I like to have used on me as a sub. I think mainly this is because whatever you are doing should excite both people and doing something to someone else that i find exciting myself will turn me on. Also it is much easier to think of ideas for tasks and games for others when you enjoy them as well.

Also it will be easier to guess subs reactions to certain things if you have similar tastes, I have used this many times when I have played.

There are exceptions though. I have had people write tasks for me before (some of which are on the forum) which have been among the best I have ever done, and they had no desire to do any of those things themselves. I think it just depends on how your imagination works, mine works by taking ideas from around me and arranging them differently, whereas some people are better at plucking ideas out of thin air.

Jas x

[EasilyStopped]

For your second point, my tastes as a switch are pretty similar. It's less that I'm submissive and more that I really get off on humiliating and degrading some kinky slut, and if I can't find anyone else, that kinky slut has to be me. I'm not being submissive, I'm just dominating myself.

[andy wood]

I almost created a separate Forums thread for this, but I decided to insert some more thoughts into this discussion.

In play where the sub is a sex toy, there is a range of ways that sexual ownership can be expressed. I will name the two most extreme endpoints, and then ask what the intermediate steps are, and how commonly each of these scenarios are followed:
1) Vanilla. The man and woman are monogamous. In a sense, each owns the other's sex, since the man cannot fuck other women, and the woman cannot fuck other men. Each is allowed solo masturbation as desired.

9) Complete, one-sided sexual ownership. The dom/me can, and probably does, own multiple submissives and can fuck or scene with anyone at any time. The submissive is in chastity, and can only cum, edge, or otherwise experience sexual stimulation with permission of the dom/me. The submissive is a shareable sex toy, who can be ordered to give pleasure to whomever the dom/me wants, whenever and however the dom/me wants.

Some intermediate steps might be:

The Dom/me is poly or promiscuous, but sub is monogamous to the dom/me.

The sub follows orgasm control rules, and/or wears a chastity device, but sub and dom/me are a monogamous couple.

**********

In "The Story of O", O was a shareable sex toy at Roissy. However, even though O could not refuse to sexually service anyone, I do not recall that she was in chastity. Was she allowed solo masturbation, or not?

I have sort-of done this. One sub girl I played with liked whore play. I paid her $10 to fuck her, and re-used the same $10 bill several times one weekend. Another sub girl mentioned that she knew of a Dom that liked to order his sub girl to fuck other guys. I am not sure if it was a hint, or just a random comment, but I told the girl that I did not want to share her.

When submitting, I have never been shared in real life, but I have had fantasies of this. In some of these fantasy scenarios, I am owned by a domme who looks like Angelina Jolie, and she rents me out, very cheaply, to a customer who looks like Pamela Anderson. (Some fantasies are more realistic than others, and this one is about zero percent real.) I have seen a fair amount of BDSM fiction which includes cuckolding, and the cuckolding often includes eating creampies or sucking the cocks of the wife's bulls. Any sort of man-on-man sex is a hard limit "no" for me. But I have wondered about being loaned out to an unattractive female. In the "rented out to Pamela Anderson" scenario, I am pretty sure I would enjoy it on a vanilla level, but would not feel any subspace, because everything I would be doing would be exactly what I want to do. At the other extreme, if I was ordered to sexually service some woman who was 99 years old and weighed 599 pounds, I am pretty sure that no amount of subspace could make me enjoy the experience, and I would probably not be able to obey any such order. But there is probably a Goldilocks zone, where a domme could persuade me to service a woman who is unattractive enough that I would not normally consider her a potential sex partner, but not so unattractive that I would completely hate the experience.

Any thoughts on this?

If someone has worked out a complete guide to "levels of sexual ownership", which cover 1 through 9 with exact intermediate steps, I would be curious to read it.