Defining Cock Hero

[alchemi183]

Thanks for all the feedback so far. A lot of you seem to be focusing on the visual beat meter and think that videos without it could still be in the list, but with some notation that indicates whether it has a beat meter or not. The list actually does this already. Videos with a beat meter have an asterisk (*) next to them.

Not to worry...I have no intention of leaving videos without a visual beat meter off of the list. supermokkori and Vindicare have created some of my favorite cock hero videos without a visual beat meter.

More tricky, in my opinion, are the videos that don't have any AUDIO beat added. Take for example the recent Plush. It's pretty clear that Plush is a PMV, but has no audio or visual stroke indicator. But the author called it "Cock Hero".

Should PMVs that have none of the usual Cock Hero elements be included in the list? I tend toward "yes" (I tend to agree with those who don't want to discourage new creators) but maybe in a separate list within the same post for "Cock Hero themed PMVs".

[servufon]

i think PMVs should be separate, they are neither games nor surrender of masturbatory authority to a 3rd party (the "director" or masturbatrix or whatever one calls one who creates a specific masturbatory rhythm with rules to follow)

just as in any liberal arts field with an ideal typing methodology, there won't be perfection, some may disagree whether a particular grey case is "really" a CH video or whether a PMV with a gaming twist is "really" PMV or CH. but from what i've seen i think these cases are and will be rare.

i don't think there's any disrespect to artists who create these by segregating PMVs from CHs, they are simply different things, IMO

i think this is a fruitful discussion and good topic to raise, thanks @alchemi183

[sam_bane]

bye

[thanatos]

Perhaps I am not asking the right question.

Do you guys have any recommendations where people who don't meet the strict cock hero standards should post?

Look at the response to BL1TZ posteed LITERALLY last night.
or PLUSH a few days before it.

Do you see how the first response anything anyone doing something experimental or new is "This ISN'T a REAL COCK HERO"

This forum seems very toxic to experimentation. Even if you couch your complaint "There is nothing WRONG with PMVs" you are still saying "This doesn't belong here."

Cool, I get it! Message received! I don't belong here. Do you have any suggestions on where I might belong?

If the forum "On Video" isn't right for videos then....where should they be posted?

I will never be "good enough" to be a real "cock hero". Especially not without more practice. The best place I have found to try and post my stuff is the empornium, but there isn't any safe place to ask for criticism.

I got really excited when I saw this post:
http://torrents.empornium.me/forums.php ... adid=18136

But it didn't turn into anything.

Anyways, if this isn't the forum for new and experimental artists like me, do you have any suggestions on where I should go?

I am looking for a place where the experimenetation of the first cock heros is still going on. If you look at the early work of cock heros, there was all kinds of different things being tried. Folx tried stuff with different kinds of instructions. With and without instructions. With beat meters, without beat meters. Different kinds of music. Some had multiple "voices" in conflict with eachother.

Sure there is a little experiementation going on now. But you have to be AMAZING like Ms. Julie to get away with it. Even her INCREDIBLE "redgreen" work got panned as "Not a REAL cock hero" even after she spent paragraphs in her description talking about how it clearly wasn't.

Or the fellow who did the beat meter with an actual Penis. WHAT A COOL IDEA.....but good thing he put out a "REAL" cock hero to go with it.

I apologize if I am ranting here, it is just frustrating to see the thing I am interested in panned over and over here when I can't find a place to go where it is safe to try new things.

Espeicially since in the early days, THIS FORUM was the place where those creative things happened.

[Coder]

"Do you guys have any recommendations where people who don't meet the strict cock hero standards should post?"

Here.

"Do you see how the first response anything anyone doing something experimental or new is "This ISN'T a REAL COCK HERO""

No?

I see people trying to find out whether it's a CH or not. Later on there's people reporting it's not a CH (which is very useful info for others).


"This forum seems very toxic to experimentation."

It isn't....or shouldn't be. Varying download options create more complaints than CHness (if you even take people pointing out that a vid isn't a CH as a 'complaint', as such)....does that put creators off? Asking whether a vid is CH shouldn't put you off anymore than.....asking whether it has hardcore &/or penisy content.


"If the forum "On Video" isn't right for videos then....where should they be posted?"


This IS the place, just don't call non-CH vids CH vids. The CH concept isn't vague, it comes directly from 'guitar hero', and everyone ITT seems clear on the definition: a precicise pattern of strokes to follow, whether audio or visual or both or....some kinda embedded estim program?



"I will never be "good enough" to be a real "cock hero"."

CH is nothing to do with quality.
CH 1 & 2 are pretty crappy (no offense to lalaland if they ever see this), but are CHs, this
http://www.milovana.com/forum/viewtopic ... 25&t=14077
is really good, (and I would welcome much more) but still isn't a CH.

[thanatos]

[pointless diatribe redacted]

[Sisyphuster]

IMO, if there isn't an identifiable audio or visual beat meter, it's not "Cock Hero" but I agree with the others that we don't want to discourage people who want to contribute to the community.

I agree with what seems to be the prevailing opinion, which is to include all videos on the list, but I think there needs to be two lists. The question is: what to call the second list. "Honorable Mention"? Maybe we call them Cock Hero: No Beat Meter (NBM)?

[Hopzzz]

Geez, people getting all bent outta shape.

I think it's a pretty simple definition of what is and what isn't considered CH. Doesn't mean non-CH is worthless or lower class or something.

I mean, what if you bought the latest Guitar Hero game and on the first song it said "just strum to the beat of the music". You might think "hey, this isn't guitar hero"....right??

[thanatos]

Your not wrong. Just having trouble with my project sorry to be all emo.

[bhlombardy]

I'm in agreement with most of the above here:

A "Cock Hero" game/video should be reminiscent of it's influence, Guitar Hero. There's a video with a song, and a definite instruction *via continual visual and/or audible cue* as to when to stroke, at what tempo, etc.
... and I don't mean a prompt that says "OK, now stroke 1-2-3-4... 1-2-3-4" The audible beat, or visual meter of some kind should be present for every stroke. Be it a sine wave, a metronome, etc

Otherwise it's just a montage; a compilation of clips set to music.

Likewise, would you call it "Cock Hero" if there was no video? What if it was a blank screen with music only, and a beat meter on how to stroke? -- I wouldn't.

Is soda still soda without the bubbles?

This doesn't mean that any video is lesser nor greater than the other. I have downloaded a few through here that are just clips set to music, which have been purely amazing. But it just doesn't fit the definition nor fit the "Cock Hero" criteria -- which is exactly what this thread is asking to define.

To me a "Cock Hero" game must include the following:
Video segments
Music overlay
Continual Beat meter (visual and/or auditory) to instruct actions.

[oniichan]

You can post any video you want in here. But if you label them as CH there are certain things people have come to expect, so don't be salty if they call you out for it.
Ms. Julie has been mentioned here, and if you look at her posts you'll see that she never called her videos Cock Hero. In fact, she says from the very start that they are not.

[sam_bane]

bye

[zingg]

Disclaimer: I only read the first page of this thread.

Personally, I think that a video with cues like "1-2" should still be considered a Cock Hero video. The intent is much closer to CH than it is to PMV. That said, what I'd like to see in the list of CH videos is some sort of indicator of whether the video has a beatmeter, added audio beats, or textual descriptions. I much prefer videos with beatmeter or audio beats.

There's also a bit of ambiguity here. Textual descriptions alone are usually ambiguous, but there's at least one video (I can't remember which) that animated it to convey the intended speed. To me, that's different than just "1-2" alone.

In general, though, inclusion in the list is not supposed to be restrictive, it's supposed to help people find more content, so it seems better to me to include things even if it's not what some (or even most) people are looking for.

[alchemi183]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the feedback. I think I'll keep doing what I've been doing....adding new CH to the top of the list, putting an (*) next to it if it has a visual beat meter. If it doesn't have visual or audible cues, then I'll add it at the bottom of the list in the "CH-Themed Porn Music Videos" section.

Also, all of the videos are linked to a thread here on Milovana where they can be discussed, so for those interested being more selective about what they download, hopefully a careful reading of other forum members reactions to a video will give them some indication of whether they are interested or not.

Here's hoping 2015 is a great year for Cock Hero! :)

[bukem]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the feedback. I think I'll keep doing what I've been doing....adding new CH to the top of the list, putting an (*) next to it if it has a visual beat meter. If it doesn't have visual or audible cues, then I'll add it at the bottom of the list in the "CH-Themed Porn Music Videos" section.

Also, all of the videos are linked to a thread here on Milovana where they can be discussed, so for those interested being more selective about what they download, hopefully a careful reading of other forum members reactions to a video will give them some indication of whether they are interested or not.

Here's hoping 2015 is a great year for Cock Hero! :)

Alchemi just wanted to thank you for the great work you do with the CH map thread. The list you wrote is a great resource to keep up with the CH´s world. Thank you for taking the time to do this